first no i do not practice open SIN, i to hope they repented the way the bible says (Romans 10-9) if thou confess with thou mouth, not want to, not with your thinking,not with should have, but with your mouth and that is the only way i beleave. the children of Isreal could not see thru Gods Wrath to see his love and today the children of god can not see through his love to his Wrath! sin unless as romans says( the word says) we can look at it any way we want but it don’t line up with the word. why would God require me to come out of the life style of the world and not them that would make God unjust i beleave if a person truly gets saved you can see it maybe they did,but if we as true children of god do not stop trying to get god to allow sin in heaven because of what (we) think again see Romans 10-9 or because some one has tailent we are in such trouble in the church world today,we can not wish them in want them in and they can not buy there way in or with popularity (only by the Blood of Jesus) today we are afraid to look sin in the face and tell it what it is. when i say the wages of sin is death it is not my words but gods. God loves every one but he hates sin we should do away with the very appreance of sin,Boy wouldn’t that make a diffrence in the world today as the world sees the church.
Does this give anyone else a headache? What did he/she just say?
Some capitalization and fewer run-on sentences would make reading it much easier.
I am not asking for a theological debate. I just want to offer a few thoughts. Do you think God grieves when any of his creation dies without accepting his sacrifice? Is God’s love only limited to those who love Him? Would the prodigal’s father have grieved over his son if he had never returned? I know how much I hurt when my son was lost. I know how many tears I cried.
I won’t pretend to know the state of MJ’s salvation at the time of his death. I pray that he accepted God’s Gift of Salvation. But if he didn’t he was still loved. He was a son, a brother, a nephew, a cousin, a father, a friend and yes, he was God’s creation. So there will be mourning over his passing, and if he died as a sinner, I think God must be grieving.
I don’t believe we should ever gloat over the death of a sinner. Do we think we won something? Should we dance at their “getting their just rewards?” Let’s never forget that we all deserve death, but for the Grace of God.
So, no, I won’t rejoice, I’ll weep!
Susan, you spoke my thoughts exactly! This is why I even commented in the first place. jd’s comment was so void of compassion….such an indifferent gesture. Your words reflect what I believe to be the feelings of an all loving creator. God loves us despite our own short-comings and failures. Therefore, it’s rational that He is hurt when one of His children leads a life full of pain and sadness, then finishes with a tragic ending. Thank God jd’s position on this doesn’t extend past his own mis-guided opinions.
While reading these posts, I realized, with guilt, that I never prayed for the salvation of either of the subject people, while they were alive. I think most of us pray for the salvation of loved ones, but what about for everybody else? What might happen if people, who have the celebrity or power to influence millions of people, became truly saved? I’m not sure praying for a collective bunch of influential people is the way to go, but maybe we could pick individuals to pray for. These individuals could be entertainers, news media leaders, POLITICAL LEADERS, even some church leaders. Ideally, these leaders, if saved, could influence others to be saved and make this world a better place to live. Could this help bring Christ’s salvation to more people in this world? It should, but in most cases I have observed, a “celebrity”, who makes it public that he has become a Christian, is ridiculed and ostracized by his or her worldly peers and his influence, not to mention his livelihood, diminishes. It’s a shame, but that’s the way this world is. We should still pray for their salvation anyway. I pray and hope that the timing of Christ’s return allows more people to become saved and that there will be a great revival. As for me, personally, I am a little homesick. Sorry if I digressed.
I too think it is sad if he did indeed die a sinful man and I weep for his soul. The thing that makes this whole hoopla ridiculous about his death is the number of people you see weeping on TV for his death not because of his soul and where he is spending eternity, but simply because of who he was and how much they loved him and his music. That, I find, disgusting because he was the personification of sin, especially in his latter years. One clip last night on the news mourning his death and elaborating on how much he’ll be missed, showed him repeatedly dancing around grabbing his crotch. For those that loved him and what he represented, I fear for their souls as well.
I do believe that God weeps when a lost soul dies. If He cared so much for us that He would send His son as the ultimate sacrifice, and did this “while we were in the act of sinning” (the literal interpretation of Romans 5:8), I can’t help but believe that He mourns when one of His creation chooses to not accept salvation.
Michael was tried and acquitted, so your statement has no bearing and what did Farrah do that this statement applies to her?...all I can say is “People who live in glass houses, should not throw stones” so buddy…put down the stones in your hand.
I agree with the comments of Franklin E Rutledge to the story you cited. I see no evidence the man repented. He likely died of a drug overdose; the same drug he wrote a song celebrating. It’s not our place to judge but let’s don’t be gullible. There is little doubt he was a pediophile. The opinion of people who have no direct knowledge and who were not there holds no value. There are no direct witnesses except for young children who testimonies are always held by the so-called intellectuals as suspect particularly when the allegations are against people in high places. Anyone who surrounds himself with folks who will shield him and who makes provisions to entertain young children (who he plied wth Jesus Juice) for days on end unobserved is up to no good. He maintained a lair filled with things to entice children. He was not entertaining many children but one young boy alone. Listen to his sister who spoke of how Michael manipulated both adults and his disturbing attraction to young, white males. People use Michael’s supposed naive nature to defend him saying things like he was childlike and would never harm a child. It is those people who are naive because even children molest younger children. His reckless lifestyle finally killed him along the way he also harmed many children while others turned their heads and chose not to know. While I agree and respect Susan’s words and admonitions, I think they apply equally to JD and those attacking JD. He’s your brother-in-Christ. He’s the one who deserves the benefit of the doubt and he certainly is entitled to his opinion or else no is. Let the stoning begin; just make sure the one to throw the first stone is without sin.
I agree with the comments of Franklin E Rutledge to the story you cited. I see no evidence the man repented. He likely died of a drug overdose; the same drug he wrote a song celebrating. It’s not our place to judge but let’s don’t be gullible. There is little doubt he was a pediophile. The opinion of people who have no direct knowledge and who were not there holds no value. There are no direct witnesses except for young children who testimonies are always held by the so-called intellectuals as suspect particularly when the allegations are against people in high places. Anyone who surrounds himself with folks who will shield him and who makes provisions to entertain young children (who he plied wth Jesus Juice) for days on end unobserved is up to no good. He maintained a lair filled with things to entice children. He was not entertaining many children but one young boy alone. Listen to his sister who spoke of how Michael manipulated both adults and his disturbing attraction to young, white males. People use Michael’s supposed naive nature to defend him saying things like he was childlike and would never harm a child. It is those people who are naive because even children molest younger children. His reckless lifestyle finally killed him along the way he also harmed many children while others turned their heads and chose not to know. While I agree and respect Susan’s words and admonitions, I think they apply equally to JD and those attacking JD. He’s your brother-in-Christ. He’s the one who deserves the benefit of the doubt and he certainly is entitled to his opinion or else no is. Let the stoning begin; just make sure the one to throw the first stone is without sin.
First note, the title of the article states that MJ reportedly accepted Jesus Christ as Savior THREE WEEKS before his death. Not sure you noticed the time frame.
I guess we’ll not know as long as we are on this earth, but I much more enjoyed reading what Jesse wrote, someone claiming to be a personal friend of Michaels and with the capability of ‘first-hand’ knowledge than this Franklin Rutledge who based his comments on his judging abilities of Michael. This is supposedly a conversion that took place three weeks prior to his death. I’m not sure what kind of evidence you were expecting in that short amount of time.
I’m not being gullible, I’m being ‘hopeful’ that this truly happened. As for being a pediophile….....there’s never been any evidence to the fact. So since “It’s not our place to judge but let’s don’t be gullible”, then I’ll not judge him in that manner when no facts have ever presented itself. There is NO doubt your statement that “there is little doubt he was a pediophile” was nothing more than judging him yourself. I have difficulty in your wit to withhold judgement, and then spend the majority of the rest of the post doing exactly that.
Michael undoubtedly had some demons in his life, but I’m very convinced that the Blood of Jesus Christ can overcome all things. I only state again that I truly hope that this report of a conversion is true.
I know that it is one of the easiest things to do as humans but instead of us judging who is and who isn’t saved - This may be a good time to reflect on our own salvation experience – If you aren’t 100% sure of it make sure you are 100% ASAP!
You may be surprised by some who are there – others may be surprised that you are there.
Just wanted to add a little perspective.
No evidence. Really. I don’t live in Neverland. An aquittal is not tantamount to an “innocent” verdict; merely that fact the jury was not convinced beyond a reasonable doubt. As one who spent 20 years in law enforcement, I have unfortunately seen many defendant walk for a myriad of reasons. In the O.J. case jury nullification, clever lawyers and slight of hand experts who could create doubt out of thin air and O.J.‘s celebrity overrode strong forenstic and circumstantial evidence. The Bruno Magli shoes that left the bloody prints at the scene were entered into evidence but connecting them to O.J. wasn’t established until later when we saw the pictures of the Bruno Magli shoes on his feet. You can say there is no evidence but you would be ignoring the “Jesus Juice” or what the rest of us call wine which was being served by Michael by his own admission to small boys he was spending inordinant time in seclusion who later reported being molested. Did you see the video where his sister talked about this man’s involvement with these boys and the extraordinary efforts that Michael went through to get access to young boys ... boys who he admits slept in his bedroom or in their bedroom and his parent’s home. These things did not go unnoticed. They alarmed many people even people who were worried Michael’s reckless behavior would become known and put him in legal jeopardy; friends and family who tried to intervene and to keep Michael away from these young white boys that was such a strong attraction to him. You are free to discount whatever you risk and you may prefer to thing well of the dead but it’s quite another thing to gloss over the facts and to ignore the elephant in the room. Nothing any of us believes or says will change Michael’s fate; but if we laud the man’s accomplishments and talent, are we also not allowed to speak of these “demons” of which you refer ... what all are you and others glossing over and including in “those demons.” I think we are talking about the same thing.
I know that it is one of the easiest things to do as humans but instead of us judging who is and who isn’t saved - This may be a good time to reflect on our own salvation experience – If you aren’t 100% sure of it make sure you are 100% ASAP!
None of us will be saved because of anything we have done; it is grace alone that will save us. The question of whether the blood of Christ will be attributed to Michael’s account is in God’s hands but let’s not ignore the obvious. Michael came from a Jehovah Witness background and he was exposed to many mystic and pagan religions through the people he knew. Nothing any of us say or believe will change Michael’s fate but that doesn’t mean we have to delude ourselves about what transpired in his life. There are different kinds of judgement. Not all judging is wrong.
I know that it is one of the easiest things to do as humans but instead of us judging who is and who isn’t saved - This may be a good time to reflect on our own salvation experience – If you aren’t 100% sure of it make sure you are 100% ASAP!
None of us will be saved because of anything we have done; it is grace alone that will save us.
Tony, this is what I was referring to when I was talking about our salvation experience….......
I know that it is one of the easiest things to do as humans but instead of us judging who is and who isn’t saved - This may be a good time to reflect on our own salvation experience – If you aren’t 100% sure of it make sure you are 100% ASAP!
None of us will be saved because of anything we have done; it is grace alone that will save us. The question of whether the blood of Christ will be attributed to Michael’s account is in God’s hands but let’s not ignore the obvious. Michael came from a Jehovah Witness background and he was exposed to many mystic and pagan religions through the people he knew. Nothing any of us say or believe will change Michael’s fate but that doesn’t mean we have to delude ourselves about what transpired in his life. There are different kinds of judgement. Not all judging is wrong.
So not even the atoning blood of Jesus is enough to save someone who’s been taught anything other than what we believe as Christians?
Talk about ‘dilusional’, but this is absolutely false.
I’m quite sure you’ll find people on this message board who once sat under Mormonism and the Jehovah’s Witness that today, are sinners saved by Grace.
The kind of responses I expected when I posted the link would be those from Christians who could basically state that they too, hoped that this was true. Never, did I think it would turn to such judgement of a man of whom in the last 3 weeks of his life may have known the Lord in a personal way, and a way in which his past (be it the accusations true or false) had no relevance now.
So not even the atoning blood of Jesus is enough to save someone who’s been taught anything other than what we believe as Christians?
Talk about ‘dilusional’, but this is absolutely false.
I’m quite sure you’ll find people on this message board who once sat under Mormonism and the Jehovah’s Witness that today, are sinners saved by Grace.
The kind of responses I expected when I posted the link would be those from Christians who could basically state that they too, hoped that this was true. Never, did I think it would turn to such judgement of a man of whom in the last 3 weeks of his life may have known the Lord in a personal way, and a way in which his past (be it the accusations true or false) had no relevance now.
Are you just trying to be argumenative? If a person is UNDER the blood of Christ, that person is SAVED because the blood covers the sins. God applies our crimes against God, nature and others to Christ’s account and he applies Christ’s righteousness to our accounts.
Does NOT matter what the person was FORMERLY; it only matters that NOW he is IN CHRIST.
FACTS IS FACTS. Wishing the BEST for Michael won’t benefit him one iota. Wishing him the WORST won’t hurt him in the least. It simply does NOT matter what we think. We don’t get a say.
If he indeed repented, that’s great. But, like the other guy said, there no evidence of change NOT even a public profession of faith let alone a renounciation of any of his former allegiances. If it makes you feel good to believe he was saved, great, but it does not change what he did in this life and the destruction he left in his path. To that we can speak. The day will come and we’ll all know how things worked out and what really happened. Nothing will be hidden; everything will be brought out into the light. Far as we know, he went to his grave claiming to be innocent. We’ll see but there is no jury that can be duped over there.
